Sunderland and Newcastle United featured in a heated Overlap discussion on football’s financial future.

Sunderland and Newcastle United were both namechecked during a passionate debate on The Overlap, as Gary Neville, Roy Keane and Marcel Desailly discussed football’s financial inequalities and whether historic clubs can ever bridge the gap to England’s super-rich elite.

Neville began the conversation by questioning how clubs such as Sunderland can realistically compete in an era where financial disparity is greater than ever between the Premier League’s top and bottom sides. “When the likes of Brighton or clubs in the lower Premier League get these types of players, they have them taken off them,” Neville said. “That’s always happened, it’s not something new – but they obviously sell them and then lose those players.

“I’m talking about how does someone take – I’m going to pick a club in the Premier League – Sunderland. How does someone come and spend? Newcastle, we’ve seen it at Newcastle. How does someone take Newcastle and Sunderland, who haven’t got the revenues of Manchester United, Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea, Manchester City… how does Sunderland become an elite club again like they have been at times in the last 100 years of English football? Or are they always going to be down here now?”

Former Sunderland and England midfielder Jill Scott quickly interjected with a smile: “We’re getting there! We’re not down there – we’re seventh (at the time of recording.” Desailly then brought up his own experiences at Chelsea in the late 1990s to highlight how different the landscape was before Financial Fair Play (FFP) and Profit and Sustainability Rules came into play.

“Chelsea, yeah,” said Desailly. “Chelsea is a good example. Before coming to Chelsea, I didn’t really know about Chelsea – I’d never really heard about them in ‘92, ‘93, ‘94. And then they built the foundation with players while spending quite a lot. They had no financial restrictions back then, and were able to spend money on players like Arjen Robben and Essien. All those players were brought in without restrictions at that time.”

Neville agreed, stressing that times have changed dramatically since then. “They built some kind of foundation, but they had no financial restrictions to be able to spend back then,” he said. “They could spend freely, and that’s how clubs like Chelsea built themselves up.”

Keane then jumped in to argue that while Newcastle have managed to re-establish themselves with smart management and investment, maintaining that success will be the real challenge. “You mentioned Newcastle, Gary – but clubs have had a taste of it,” said Keane. “The problem is maintaining it. They’ve got a brilliant manager, they obviously won a cup last year, and they’re in Europe. So they’ve had a taste of it. The problem for all these clubs is maintaining it.”

Neville noted that even Newcastle are not immune to modern financial realities, highlighting how player sales have already become a necessity to balance the books. “I think Newcastle have had to sell two or three of their best young players just to stay afloat,” he said.

Desailly then broadened the discussion to the wider issue of how clubs can still find ways to grow responsibly under financial restrictions – and argued football should be more open to investment. “You need to build up a generation of players that doesn’t cost too much and then top up with experienced players,” he said.

“You might also have your own trick to invest indirectly – money that benefits the club but doesn’t get caught up in financial fair play. There are many ways. There’s a moment where we should open up a little bit more. I’m not into administration, but we should open it a bit more. We should not be scared about money being injected into the football business.”

Neville then suggested that, for club owners, the rising salaries of players remain the biggest financial threat in football. “If I’m an owner out here, the thing that would scare me most is the increasing salaries of players,” Neville said.

“It’s a difficult conversation for us because we were players ourselves, and I was part of the PFA – I would have fought every day of my life to stop salary caps. But is there a case for salary caps now, to make sure clubs are more sustainable?”

Desailly was quick to disagree. “I would not agree on salary caps because I’m a defender and I believe in my own capability and level,” he said. “You cannot compare me with anyone else in the club. I would not accept to earn the same thing as my mate playing beside me.”

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The former France international centre-back concluded: “Back in the day, Laurent Blanc or Frank Leboeuf – I would not accept that. We are dealing with talent. It’s different. You have to reward talent in a different way. You’ll never have equality in salaries. It’s not possible.”

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